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899 lines
55 KiB
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[1][ISMAP]-[2][Home]
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### GUIDE ### [3][Background] [4][Synopsis] [5][Credits] [6][Episode
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List] [7][Previous] [8][Next]
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_Contents:_ [9]Overview - [10]Backplot - [11]Questions - [12]Analysis
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- [13]Notes - [14]JMS
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_________________________________________________________________
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Overview
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Lyta Alexander, the station's first telepath, returns with a
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warning that one of Babylon 5's officers is an operative for a
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top-secret government organization. A long-held secret of another
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Babylon 5 officer is revealed. [15]Patricia Tallman as Lyta
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Alexander.
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Sub-genre: Mystery/Intrigue
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[16]P5 Rating: [17]8.50
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Production number: 220
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Original air date: July 25, 1995 (UK)
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October 11, 1995 (US)
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Written by J. Michael Straczynski
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Directed by Jesus Trevino
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_________________________________________________________________
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Backplot
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* Lyta Alexander is part of a secret movement against Psi Corps.
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She's evidently been a dissident since she probed Kosh ([18]"The
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Gathering.") When Lyta probed Kosh, she felt something she then
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hid from the years of subsequent interrogations from Psi-Corps.
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She has been feeling drawn to Vorlon space and has desperately
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tried to get there. She knows a lot more than she has ever told
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anyone, including what Kosh is under his suit.
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* Talia Winters was programmed with a 'sleeper' personality by the
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Psi Corps. She is probably "Control" (cf. [19]"A Spider in the
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Web.")
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* Ivanova is a latent telepath. She is able to block some scans,
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knows instantly if someone scans her, can pick up on some
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feelings, but has never been able to scan anyone except her
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mother. She claims, though, that her psi rating is "not even a
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P1."
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* "Universe Today" has a section called 'Eye on Minbari' which
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Delenn uses to find out things about her homeworld she might not
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neccessarily have been told yet, in addition to learning human
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perceptions of Minbari.
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* Lyta spent some time with Psi Cops as part of her training, but
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left because she didn't like it and became a commercial telepath
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instead.
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Unanswered Questions
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* Exactly how much _does_ Talia's new persona know? And what will
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this do to B5 in the future?
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* Is there really no chance of the old Talia recovering? If not,
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what good is the recording Kosh made?
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* How safe is Lyta's escape? Will Psi-corps get her in the end? The
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fact that Kosh let her off the station suggests he's prepared to
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risk Psi-Corps getting their grubby hands on whatever it is she
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knows from the scan.
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* What did Lyta see when she asked Kosh to reveal himself? Something
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with a halo of light, but what?
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* Dr. Kyle also saw Kosh. Has Psi-Corps learned anything from him
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that they didn't learn from Lyta?
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* How involved are Sinclair's rangers with the Mars resistance?
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* Was it Talia who attempted to kill Lyta?
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* How did (presumably) Talia get the lights in the security section
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to go out, being replaced with red backups? And how did she know
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that she had a chance to hit Lyta? She was being taken from one
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cell to another on orders passed from Garibaldi to Zack to two
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ordinary security people. Is Zack implicated in some way, perhaps
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by way of his involvement in Nightwatch? It seems conincidental
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that in the few minutes available an attempt was made on Lyta's
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life.
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* What about Ironheart (cf. [20]"Mind War?") If he saw "everything,"
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would he not have known about the implanted personality, however
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deep it was?
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* What will Psi Corps do with Talia now that the Artificial
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Personality has taken control?
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* Was the 'Control' mentioned by Lyta the same one installed by
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Bureau 13?
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* Was Garibaldi _really_ faking the transition to an artificial
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personality? And does he know more that he's letting on? (see
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[21]Analysis)
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* How will Sheridan and Delenn handle the growing feelings in their
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friendship?
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* Why is Babylon 5 seen to be so important to several unknown
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individuals/groups, and who are those people?
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Analysis
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* Whatever Ironheart did to Talia seems to have enhanced her powers
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enormously, and she seems to be growing more powerful. Psi Corps,
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at a minimum, now have the psychic assassin they were trying to
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create, and potentially much more. Assuming, of course, that
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Ironheart's gift wasn't erased when Talia's original personality
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was destroyed.
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* Another possibility is that Talia _wasn't_ destroyed, that
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Ironheart's gift allowed her to prevent Control from taking over,
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but she's playing along as a means of continuing her own
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investigation into what's going on with Psi-Corps (cf. [22]"Spider
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in the Web.")
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* Talia's implanted personality was foreshadowed in [23]"The Quality
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of Mercy." After she was finished scanning Mueller, she was joined
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by Garibaldi in the Garden. As they talked about her experience,
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she commented to him, "Things that live inside us, Mr. Garibaldi.
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Terrible things. Terrible."
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* Delenn's choice of articles in Universe Today is a revealing one.
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This highlights the lack of information she is receiving now that
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she is no longer a member of the Grey Council. However, she is
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learning to gather information from other sources and to "read
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between the lines" more carefully. It appears that she is
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regaining confidence in her abilities.
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* During the attempted murder of Lyta while she is being transfered
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between holding cells, we see the hand holding the assailants PPG.
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It is wearing a black glove, very similar to those worn by Talia.
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However, the lead time between Garibaldi ordering Lyta to be
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moved, and the attempted assassination appears to be very short.
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So how did Talia know when to leave Ivanova's quarters in order to
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intercept Lyta? And does Talia know how to kill the main lights in
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a section? Three possibilities present themselves:
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1. Coincidence. Talia, under the control of the artificial
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personality (AP), goes to hunt down and kill Lyta while
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Ivanova is out getting some air. The fact that Lyta was being
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transferred made the attempt much easier. Killing the main
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lights is knowledge that Talia has but we aren't shown.
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However, in [24]"A Spider in the Web," we _are_ shown that
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Bureau 13 has cracked the station computer's security, which
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presumably would allow Talia to discover both Lyta's location
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and the time of the transfer.
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2. There is an additional agent provocateur on Babylon 5.
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Someone who does have the knowledge of Lyta's movements, and
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would know how to kill the main lights in a section. This
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strongly suggests Garibaldi, but might be Zack or another
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member of the security staff. A trigger message is sent to
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Talia, who then attempts to kill Lyta.
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3. As above, there is an additional mole on Babylon 5, but it is
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this individual who knows about Lyta's movements, knows how
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to short circuit the main lights, and attempts to kill Lyta.
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In this case, Talia is innocently caught up in the actions of
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another individual attempting to protect themselves. There is
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additional evidence that might be seen to support this (see
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below).
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* How does Talia know that Lyta Alexander is aboard Babylon 5? She
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may have guessed indirectly from a conversation with Ivanova and
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done some digging of her own, but Ivanova only asks if Talia knew
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Lyta - not telling her that she was aboard. Alternatively, she
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learnt of this through her PsiCorps contacts. Or Talia arranged
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(at the suggestion of the submerged AP) for her quarters to be out
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of use so that she could be closer to Ivanova. Once close enough,
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she could scan Ivanova and learn about the cell group, also
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learning about Lyta at the same time. When Talia wakes up (finding
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Ivanova gone) she has no gloves on. Physical contact may be used
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to intensify mental contact, and Talia might have done this while
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Ivanova was sleeping. Talia's new personality indicates that there
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_was_ an ulterior motive for getting close to Ivanova.
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* Garibaldi's flashbacks refer to [25]"Deathwalker," where Kosh uses
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a ViCaR (or VCR, an individual with an enhanced photographic
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memory) to conduct a strange negotiation, with Talia monitoring. A
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data crystal was also passed to Kosh from the ViCaR, and Talia
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doesn't know what it contained. Kosh's comments seem to indicate
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his awareness of Talia's AP and what will happen when it is
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activated. So, has Kosh recorded a copy of Talia's personality
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onto a data crystal? We have already seen that the Earth Alliance
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has the technology to wipe a personality and build a new one
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([26]"The Quality of Mercy".) Will this be a way for Sheridan to
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wipe out the AP and any knowledge that PsiCorps might pick up from
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Talia? It may not be so easy (see [27]JMS Speaks).
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* Garibaldi believed Lyta and her story. Considering how strongly
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this goes against his previous behaviour, does he have an ulterior
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motive? This may tie in with some of the speculation about Lyta's
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attempted murder. See also the following two points.
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* When Taro Isogi is killed by the modified Free Mars leader ([28]"A
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Spider in the Web,") Control identifies Talia Winters (who
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witnessed the murder) as someone who should also be eliminated.
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Given that Lyta Alexander referred to the (then unknown) sleeper
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agent as 'Control', can we draw the conclusion that Talia was part
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of a Bureau 13 operation? Or are there different sections of
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PsiCorps treading on each other's toes? It seems unlikely that
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Talia ordered her own execution, especially if Lyta is right about
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Control being programmed for self-preservation.
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* Garibaldi's "faked" personality transition was taken by all the
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others as being a joke in bad taste. But consider an alternative
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explanation: Lyta stated that the AP would say or do anything to
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protect itself, and Garibaldi was behaving out of character. He
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also immediately turned everyone's attention to Ivanova. Talia was
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caught unprepared for the sending of the password, but Garibaldi
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knew that the password would be sent. Garibaldi knew, or could
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easily have found out, when Lyta was slated to be moved, so could
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have pulled the trigger. And he was ready to bring Talia into the
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conspiracy, perhaps in order to expose it indirectly.
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However, it is unlikely that two different sleepers would respond
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to the same password, and the events in the "flashforward" scene
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in [29]"Babylon Squared" would suggest that Garibaldi's loyalty is
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not in question.
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* Ivanova was also awake at the time, and unaccounted-for, making
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her a suspect.
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* How high up the chain of Psi-Corps command does this implanting
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go? There is every indication the it's above Bester. Twice in the
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series Bester has suspected and even accused Talia of conspiring
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against the Corps. Why would he suspect or accuse her of this if
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he knew he had an ally inside her brain?
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* The Delenn/Sheridan relationship is growing stronger. Neither
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Delenn or Sheridan are making a strong attempt to hide their
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growing trust and respect for each other. After the events in
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[30]"Confessions and Lamentations," Delenn has drawn emotional
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support from Sheridan. Her growing affection for him is something
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that she clearly shows in her face and actions while they are in
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the garden talking. Sheridan also appears to be happy that he has
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someone who he can turn to who will help him when all around is
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madness, and is wondering just where all this is leading.
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* The relationship between Talia and Ivanova is one that will
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attract much debate.
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At the start of the episode, it seems clear that they are just
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friends. Talia would not hesitate to impose on Ivanova's sleeping
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quarters if there were anything stronger.
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During the episode, as Ivanova becomes more and more worried about
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revealing her (limited) telepathic ability, she relies on Talia
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during the expression of her feelings and doubts. There is an
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apparent emotional tension between them that might be interpreted
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as a "should I make the first move," or as Talia's giving support
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but hesitating to probe further, and Ivanova's "should I trust
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her, even though she's a telepath?"
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When Talia wakes up in Ivanova's bed, finding her missing, it is
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tempting to jump to the "obvious" conclusion. However we know that
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Ivanova's quarters only has one cot (indicated in [31]"The Long
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Dark" by Dr. Franklin.) Of course, Ivanova probably has a
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sofa/couch that might have been used.
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When Ivanova has her final conversation with the dominated Talia,
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she indicates that it gave Talia the words that would get her
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close to all Ivanova knew. Just how much Talia knows about Ivanova
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is unclear, and we have no indication of just how close in
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addition to the emotional bond.
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Had Ivanova and Talia had a physical relationship then Ivanova
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might have revealed her latent telepathy ("Do you know what its
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like when telepaths make love?" in [32]"Mind War.") Since the
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alternate Talia didn't goad Ivanova about this, then either
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Ivanova maintained a block, or they didn't have a physical
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relationship.
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* Ivanova's relationship with her mother is opened up further by her
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revelation of being a latent telepath, although this is not
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explored directly. Since Ivanova could initiate contact with her
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mother, she could obtain a clear mental as well as physical
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picture of her mothers deterioration under the PsiCorps telepathic
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suppression drugs. The drugs would of course prevent any attempt
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at contact initiated by her mother, and also of any blocking.
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We now have a clearer understanding of how Ivanova developed her
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strong feelings against PsiCorps, and what she must have overcome
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in order to establish her friendship with Talia. This change in
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Talia (and the AP claiming to have directed the growth of their
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friendship) may have far reaching effects in her ability to trust
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again.
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* Sheridan has now seen a part of his Kosh-induced dream ([33]"All
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Alone in the Night") come true. In the dream he saw Ivanova with a
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black raven on her shoulder, and heard her say: "Do you know who I
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am?" At what point will other parts of the dream come true? (If
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they haven't already.)
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* Why did Sheridan let Talia go so easily? He could have held her on
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charges of shooting two security guards, if nothing else. Perhaps
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he felt that doing so would draw too much attention to his covert
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activities.
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* Since a Ranger was involved in smuggling the data crystal to Lyta,
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Garibaldi may have been warned of her arrival.
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* Delenn appeared to be turning down closer relations with the
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Lumati (cf. [34]"Acts of Sacrifice") when Lyta called. Why? (Maybe
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their method of closing treaties is a bit closer than she'd prefer
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the relations to get.)
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* JMS says (see [35]jms speaks) that originally, Takashima ([36]"The
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Gathering") was going to be the plant, and that that part of the
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storyline was transferred over to Talia with the cast changes
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between pilot and series. The other events in "The Gathering,"
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combined with some revelations from the comic series (cf. comic 8,
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[37]"Silent Enemies") suggest some disturbing connections.
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Psi Corps was working with Minbari dissidents to kill a Vorlon.
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The comic has also established a connection between Psi Corps and
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the Shadows, although this has not yet been seen on screen. If the
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comic is to be believed, there is a link through Psi Corps between
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the Shadows and elements of the Minbari warrior caste. The effects
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of that link on the coming war may be quite unfortunate for one
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side or the other.
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Notes
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* Zack is still wearing his "Nightwatch" armband ([38]"In the Shadow
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of Z'ha'dum") and Garibaldi is a little bemused by it. Clearly he
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doesn't quite approve of the idea.
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* The Pak'ma'ra have separate toilet facilities. Oddly, the warning
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sign next to the door is written, among other languages, in
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Vorlon! Or at least, in a script identical to that displayed by
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Kosh's ship in [39]"Hunter, Prey."
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* At least one of the fugitives in the sewers on Mars was clearly a
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ranger. The other may not necessarily have been. Lyta arrived in a
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shot-up ship and knows that two men died for the information.
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Obviously she has links with the rangers.
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* Delenn lies yet again, and is caught immediately.
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* When Delenn is dictating her response to the Lumati, the computer
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screen shows the text appearing (whether this is Lumati writing or
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Minbari isn't clear.) One odd thing about it is that it
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alternately flows in both directions, up and down, across the
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width of the screen from left to right.
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* Production gaffe: In the first live-action shot after the title
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sequence, as Sheridan enters the restroom, one of the production
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crew's hands (likely the director's) can be seen briefly at the
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bottom of the screen.
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jms speaks
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* "Divided Loyalties" will produce a stunning revelation about one
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of our major characters.
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* Pat is nothing less than terrific. If there was any sense of
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hesitation in her appearance in "Divided Loyalties," it can be
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attributed to the fact that she had just given birth to her son
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something like 4-6 weeks prior, if that much, and this was pretty
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much her first day back in the saddle.
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* _Does the comic series contain spoilers for the series?_
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There's only one case of this conflict, so if you want to avoid
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any spoilers, here's my recommendation: when the last issue of
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this current story arc comes out, resolving the
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Mars/Sinclair/Garibaldi thread, pick up that last issue and stick
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it in a bag until after the first new ep airs in October. THEN
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read it. You'll know it when you find it.
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* The impact of Talia's situation should be the same whether you saw
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the comic or not. (And, remember, the idea was that the comic
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would come out AFTER the remaining year 2 episodes, as a nice
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little frisson, not as required data.)
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* Re: things you don't expect to happen...that's kind of one aspect
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I was after here. By way of comparison....
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There's one great thing about The Shining, despite some other
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flaws in the film: they set up Scatman Cruthers (sp?) as the one
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guy who understands what's going on...he gets the Shining, he's a
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potentially heroic character, and when all hell breaks loose, he's
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the one to get into the snow plow, cross terrible weather, we're
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all sure he's going to get there and fight the menace... he
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overcomes weather and nonsense to get there... he blows through
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the front door, ready for action... and gets an axe in the middle
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of his chest and dies.
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I *loved* that, and always kinda wanted to something of that
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nature, where you set someone up to be that kind of character, the
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future, whatever, then you yank it back and let the audience say,
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Oh, hell, NOW what?
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* "If Talia is 'the future' then why is she off the show?"
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Because stuff happens. Because rocketry was the hope of the German
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Luftwaffe to win the war. Didn't work out that way. Just because a
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character says it, doesn't mean that it's guaranteed to happen at
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all times. A parent can look at a child and say, "He's our hope
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for the future," and the next day the kid gets turfed by a
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semi-truck. Stuff happens. Nothing is guaranteed in the B5
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universe; any character -- ANY character -- is vulnerable. That,
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for me, is part of what's exciting.
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* RE: Talia...look, you've kinda got to look at this the way I do.
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Stuff happens. Yes, Talia was hoped for to be a key to the
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solution of the problem. (Not the key, but a key.) But if you do
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that, every single time, you become predictable. It means you, the
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audience, can relax. "Well, we know now that Talia will always get
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through this because she's the one they're hoping for." Suspense:
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gone. Story: suddenly predictable. There's no rule that every
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person who is hoped to help solve the problem in real life is
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gonna make it to the end or BE that solution. So if you delete
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that person, now it's "Oh, hell, NOW what're they gonna do?" which
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is more intrinsically interesting to me than the other option.
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Generally speaking, about once a year, toward the end of the year,
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I kinda look around at the characters with a loaded gun in my
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hand, and say, "Hmmm...if I take out *that* person, what happens?
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Is there anyone here I can afford to lose? Would it be more
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dramatically interesting to have this person alive, or dead? What
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is the absolute bare minimum of characters I need to get to the
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end of the story and achieve what I have to achieve?"
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It helps to really remember that this is a *novel*, and uses the
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structure of a novel. That means you have to have some real
|
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suprises as you go. Anyone is fair game. To the question "Why did
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you get rid of Sinclair? Why'd you get rid of [_spoiler removed_]?
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Why'd you get rid of Talia? Why'd you get rid of....oh, er, that
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hasn't happened yet...." there is only one answer: 'cause I felt
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like it, and 'cause I thought it'd make the story a lot more
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interesting.
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The stories I like best are the ones that ratchet up the tension
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and the uncertainty inch by inch until you're screaming. This
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could apply to any of Stephen King's novels (and recall that a lot
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of my background is in horror writing). Mother Abigail in THE
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STAND was supposed to be their hope for the future. So in short
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order she's vulture-food, JUST when she's most needed. *Because
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that's interesting*. It makes you say, "Oh, hell, NOW what?"
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(Stephen actually does that a lot in his books, and it's a
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technique I've learned as well.) Boromir in LoTR was a capable,
|
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skilled fighter, deemed absolutely essential to the Company of the
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Ring...oops, there he is by the tree, full of Orc arrows.
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Stuff happens.
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Same here.
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* One other thought on Talia...one of the motifes we've played with
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from the start was always showing Talia in mirrors...in Race, in
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Z'ha'dum and others...always showing the reflection, her opposite,
|
|
just to set stuff up on an emotional/symbological level.
|
|
* The Talia situation likely could've been finessed more smoothly
|
|
than it was, no mistake. Sometimes there are going to be ragged
|
|
spots. It's going to happen.
|
|
Here's the best comparison to what my position is with this show:
|
|
Harlan Ellison has, on occasion, done this routine where he'll go
|
|
into a bookstore and write a story in full view of everyone. As
|
|
each page is finished, it's taped to the wall unti it's done. This
|
|
is considered a pretty nifty trick, sustained over maybe 15-20
|
|
pages.
|
|
That's pretty much what I'm doing here. It's an ongoing story. I
|
|
can't go back, I can only go forward. As each page (episode) is
|
|
finished, it's put up on the wall, and I have to go on to the next
|
|
one. So far I've written 2,400 pages on that wall. Again, I can't
|
|
go back and change anything, and if there's a bump caused by a
|
|
real world incident, it simply has to be accommodated as best I
|
|
can while still going where I have to go.
|
|
From time to time, there's going to be a misstroke on the
|
|
keyboard, or there's going to be a typo that I'll miss. That's
|
|
inevitable when you're out performing in front of a massive crowd
|
|
on the high wire without a net. As long as the totality of it all
|
|
hangs together, as long as the story is told, the trick finally
|
|
done...then that's what fundamentally matters.
|
|
That this happens on occasion should be obvious; that it happens
|
|
as rarely as it does is the point of wonderment, I think.
|
|
Remember, it's all trial and error, because no one's ever done
|
|
this before. And right about now I understand why. But we're
|
|
making it work.
|
|
* _Andrea Thompson has said in interviews that she felt Talia got
|
|
short shrift._
|
|
There are a number of actors who feel that if they're in a story
|
|
then they should be at the *center* of the story. Andrea seemed to
|
|
feel that if she was in an episode, the episode should be about
|
|
her character, and was consistently lobbying for this, despite the
|
|
fact that it would cut into the arc, and time for the other
|
|
characters on-screen. Babylon 5 is an ensemble show; time on
|
|
screen is determined by the story, not by whim or personal
|
|
insistence.
|
|
Yes, we used her 8 or 9 times in a given season; but by contract,
|
|
we paid her for a full 13 episodes, whether she appeared in them
|
|
or not. We were never under any obligation to give her *any*
|
|
guarantee; we did so to make her feel comfortable taking on the
|
|
job. For the first year he was on the show Jeff Conaway didn't
|
|
have a guarantee of episodes; he was used as he was needed, and
|
|
that grew with time. Andrea wanted time away from the show to do
|
|
other projects; we accommodated where we could, as we do with all
|
|
our cast members, but if a request comes in at the last moment, or
|
|
conflicts with our schedule, we can't comply. We feel that if
|
|
we're paying someone a great sum of money to be available to us,
|
|
for episodes they may not even appear in, this is not
|
|
unreasonable.
|
|
Finally, it was never Warner Bros. who hired her or pushed her on
|
|
me. WB didn't care one way or another. I was the one who hired
|
|
her, with Doug Netter. If I hadn't felt she was right for the
|
|
role, I wouldn't have hired her. But I was also under no
|
|
constraint to make the show into the Andrea Thompson Show. Andreas
|
|
and Peter have often appeared as many times in a season as Andrea,
|
|
and didn't even *have* a guarantee for the first two seasons. (Now
|
|
they do.)
|
|
We did what we could to accommodate her without destroying the
|
|
story arc. I regret that she has taken out her frustrations in
|
|
this way. Either one is a team player, part of an ensemble, or one
|
|
is not. We are very proud of the fact that the cast members as
|
|
they stand now are all ensemble, team players.
|
|
* In the B5 universe, as a general rule of thumb, people don't just
|
|
come back after something like this. "Talia" has been destroyed
|
|
permanently; that's what it said in the episode, and that's the
|
|
way it'll stay.
|
|
* What was the password? I'm hideously tempted to say, "Z'ha'dum."
|
|
* One thing you have to remember is that while Talia is in the
|
|
opening credits, to Psi Corps she's just one more of many
|
|
programmed individuals in various places. The character in
|
|
"Spider" was a highly valued infiltration unit, with very
|
|
expensive "parts." Of the two, Talia would've been far more
|
|
expendable.
|
|
And I don't recall that Control actually issued any death order;
|
|
it was the Psi Corps/B13 in any event.
|
|
* _Was Garibaldi at Lyta's ship because the Rangers told him she was
|
|
coming?_
|
|
No, Garibaldi was there because the ship's ID# didn't check out,
|
|
as he stated, and it could've been in the process of smuggling or
|
|
who knows what.
|
|
* Absolutely *nothing* from prior seasons/episodes has been
|
|
discarded. So if that's your concern...don't worry about it.
|
|
In very tense situations, some people feel compelled to somehow
|
|
break the tension. Hence, that sequence. [Garibaldi's "gotcha"]
|
|
* The problem in trying to keep something mysterious and vague is
|
|
that sometimes you can outsmart yourself, and get confusing. The
|
|
*theory* is that there was the Bureau as Control overall back on
|
|
Earth; and a minor Control figure on B5. And Controls are always
|
|
referred to as "he"regardless of the facts to avoid giving any
|
|
means of identification to anoutsider based on gender.
|
|
So it would be
|
|
BUREAU CONTROL
|
|
----------------------|---------------------
|
|
| | |
|
|
Earthdome Control B5 Control Minipax Control
|
|
(That's a breakdown using artificial and not necessarily correct
|
|
elements, just for illustration.)
|
|
It is, however, a confusing bit of terminology, so it's been
|
|
amended subsequently.
|
|
* _Up until the coup, was the EA government pretty good?_
|
|
The EA was fairly easy going, but remember that people are used to
|
|
a heavy governmental hand during the Earth/Minbari War. It's in a
|
|
way similar to the situation we had post WW2; the only way we
|
|
could make it past that war and survive was through strict
|
|
discipline, following orders, going along with rationing,
|
|
conserving, everything. And it was that positive attitude that
|
|
those who came later would exploit in the McCarthy/Red Scare
|
|
1950s, and hit us sideways in the 60s.
|
|
* _If Talia was Control in "Spider in the Web," why would she order
|
|
herself eliminated?_
|
|
My sense was that the Control part, which sometimes moved at
|
|
night, reported that the mission could be jeapordized. Then B13
|
|
gave the order to eliminate. Nowhere does it say that Control said
|
|
the second half of the sentence.
|
|
* _Control was referred to as "he."_
|
|
You always refer to agents in the single "he" form to avoid giving
|
|
away identities.
|
|
That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
|
|
* _Was the hand that fired the PPG a left or a right hand?_
|
|
I don't remember offhand; I'll have to check the tape. (I have a
|
|
vague memory that it was a right hand originally, flopped to shoot
|
|
in the other direction.)
|
|
* Not that it just looked better per se, but the gunshots came from
|
|
right to left; the gun hand as originally shot fired from left to
|
|
right. It looked very funky when edited together, like it was
|
|
going in a different direction than the one it was fired in.
|
|
Flopping the shot corrected that.
|
|
* Yeah, I wouldn't waste much time on the gun-hand, frankly.
|
|
* _About [40]"The Quality of Mercy"_
|
|
Yes, part of the reason for the episode was to set up the notion
|
|
of an implanted personality as acheivable tech.
|
|
* _Couldn't Ironheart have removed Control? Was Talia the original
|
|
personality?_
|
|
Control was the construct. The alternate personality was dormant
|
|
at the time Ironheart was there.
|
|
* Remember that Ironheart was not seeing Talia under the best of
|
|
conditions...he was fighting hard NOT to use his abilities, for
|
|
any reason, because it created mindquakes...he was pulling
|
|
everything IN. And later he was shot, also not a good position.
|
|
* _Does Psi Corps have Talia's gift now? Isn't that a problem?_
|
|
Logically, yes, that would eventually pose a problem.
|
|
* _Was the new personality formed by modifying Talia's, or was it
|
|
created from scratch?_
|
|
I'd rather let this aspect slide for the moment.
|
|
* Remember, the *conscious* Talia did none of those things; she
|
|
would never dream of scanning without permission. (And in
|
|
Ivanova's case, remember that she said she knows *instantly* if
|
|
she's being scanned. Note her strong reaction in "Eyes" when it
|
|
happens.)
|
|
* Talia v 1.0 would not have violated Ivanova's privacy during any
|
|
kind of intimacy, as that would violate her profoundly; you can
|
|
hold back, and Talia would have, and Ivanova would've sensed if
|
|
she had tried it. The theory on telepaths making love is that they
|
|
both willingly drop the blocks they normally keep in place.
|
|
* The real Talia was becoming more and more disenchanted with PC,
|
|
and this was in time going to pull her into resistance activities,
|
|
which Talia v2.0 would only be *thrilled* about. The
|
|
self-protection mechanism only kicks in when the personality's
|
|
existence is threatened.
|
|
* _Why did they kick Talia off the station?_
|
|
Because the longer she was there, the more she'd discover (was
|
|
about to enter into Sheridan's cell group in fact), and the more
|
|
damage she'd be able to do.
|
|
* Oh, to be sure, they'd have preferred to have Talia accidentally
|
|
fall out an airlock rather than turn her over to the Corps...but
|
|
that's cold blooded murder, and if they go that route, then
|
|
there's no difference between them and their opposite number.
|
|
* . . . Re: Talia...it's okay to be pissed about that; it was
|
|
intended to have that reaction. Things *should* get us annoyed
|
|
when Psi Corps pulls a stunt like that. And we haven't heard the
|
|
last of what happened to Talia, btw. That's the B5 universe for
|
|
you....
|
|
* _Did Lyta sense Ivanova's talent?_
|
|
A non-telepath can learn certain tricks to make it harder to break
|
|
through, albeit briefly, so the reaction was sufficiently
|
|
ambiguous and the event sufficiently brief that it wouldn't raise
|
|
too many concerns. Which is why Sheridan dived in when he did; if
|
|
she'd continue to block much longer, just instinctively, it
|
|
would've revealed her latent potential. It was his distracting
|
|
Ivanova that in a sense helped Lyta break through.
|
|
* _Could Ivanova sense when someone else was being scanned?_
|
|
No, that she wouldn't really be capable of doing at her present
|
|
level.
|
|
* Of *course* the telepath issue will have to be dealt with; this is
|
|
a logical progression of the story, no?
|
|
* _Was a kiss between Ivanova and Talia edited out?_
|
|
Nope, no such scene was cut. It's just a slightly awkward match in
|
|
the edited shots.
|
|
* No, nothing was cut; we had a matching problem at one point in the
|
|
edit, where Andrea reached with her left hand in one angle, and
|
|
didn't reach out with the other, and we had to come around for the
|
|
shot on Ivanova, so it looked a tick off. But nothing was cut.
|
|
* Film is shot on the stage, then transferred to video, which is
|
|
then digitized onto the Avid computer editing system, which holds
|
|
every take of every scene. A scene is shot many times from various
|
|
angles: wide master shot, three-shots (3 people), two-shots,
|
|
singles, raking twos, close ups, medium shots, extreme closeups
|
|
and sometimes downshots (as well as CGI and composite shots).
|
|
John Copeland and I then go in and work on the version of the
|
|
episode edited by the director to do the producer's cut. We sit
|
|
down with the editor, and go scene by scene. The usual
|
|
construction is as follows: you get a wide master shot so we know
|
|
the geography, where we are, and where everyone is in relation to
|
|
that. Gradually you go closer, into threes or twos, then singles
|
|
or closeups for dramatic emphasis, coming out into the master from
|
|
time to time when someone has to move, or to break the sense of
|
|
claustrophobia.
|
|
When you get in close, you have over-the-shoulder shots, meaning
|
|
you're shothe same thing in reverse, so you see both sides of the
|
|
conversation. You do these one at a time, for lighting purposes;
|
|
you light one side of the room for the scenes looking left-right,
|
|
then move the camera and the lighting around for the scenes when
|
|
you're on the right side looking left (or, phrased differently,
|
|
you light for Susan looking at Talia, then Talia looking at
|
|
Susan). The actors then do the scene again, with the camera on the
|
|
other side.
|
|
The actor has to be very careful to always repeat each movement
|
|
exactly; if he picks up a teacup on th word "quibble," he has to
|
|
make absolutely sure he picks up the cup on exactly that same
|
|
word, every time, in every take, in the same way, in the correct
|
|
hand. If the actor slips (and this sometimes happens), when you go
|
|
to show tther side of the scene, you suddenly find you have a
|
|
matching problem; in the shot over Talia's shoulder to Susan, the
|
|
actor raised a hand; in the shot over Susan's shoulder to Talia,
|
|
the actor (generic term that includes women) *didn't* raise a
|
|
hand. So when you edit the two, you have a matching problem. You
|
|
can sometimes avoid this by just staying on one side of the shot,
|
|
but then you can't get the other character's on-face reaction to
|
|
what's being said. And in that scene in particular, we *needed* to
|
|
see both sides.
|
|
* We will see Lyta again.
|
|
RE: alternate lifestyles...I said when stuff happened, we wouldn't
|
|
make a big deal out of it, it'd just be there...and I said we'd
|
|
address it in our own way, in our own time. We've done a bit here,
|
|
we'll do a bit more down the road. I won't give you or anyone a
|
|
timetable; I'll do stuff as the integrity of the story permits,
|
|
not sooner, not later. I will not allow this to become a political
|
|
football. If you do nothing, folks yell at you for ignoring it; if
|
|
you do a little, they yell for not doing more; if you do more,
|
|
they yell for not doing it sooner. Screw it. I do what the story
|
|
calls for, as the story calls for it.
|
|
* Susan and Talia had been dancing around one another for months;
|
|
that night, though, would've been the first time they got
|
|
physically intimate.
|
|
* See, here's where I start to have a problem. For starters, I don't
|
|
do any thing to be politically correct, or politically incorrect,
|
|
I do what I do in any story because that's what the story points
|
|
me toward. Anybody who says "It's not necessary" isn't entitled to
|
|
that judgement, frankly; you don't know what's necessary to the
|
|
story. And by framing it in the "is this NECESSARY?" way is
|
|
designed to make you defend your position when such defense isn't
|
|
the point; is it NECESSARY to have humor? to have a romance? to
|
|
have correct science? No, *nothing* is NECESSARY. It's what the
|
|
writer feels is right for that scene, that story, that character.
|
|
"Oh, well, I saw it, but was all that violence NECESSARY?" This
|
|
is, frankly, a BS observation usually offered by someone with an
|
|
agenda, who wishes to invalidate the notion of an artistic view
|
|
and impose some kind of quota, or objective criterion to what is
|
|
and isn't necessary for a movie or film. As far as I'm concerned,
|
|
the first person to throw this into a discussion has, frankly,
|
|
just lost the argument.
|
|
Point the second: one of the most consistent comments I get, in
|
|
email and regular mail, is the spirituality conveyed in the show,
|
|
that we have shown, and will continue to show, tolerance toward
|
|
religion, even created sympathetic religious characters. "Thank
|
|
you for your tolerance," they say...until we show somebody or some
|
|
action THEY don't like...and at that point suddenly it's a lot of
|
|
tsk-tsking and chest thumping and disapproval; so okay, how about
|
|
I just stop all positive religious aspects of the show?
|
|
It seems to me, that if I do *all that* with religion, and with
|
|
thje (the) simple act of showing maybe ONE PERSON in all the long
|
|
history of TV science fiction across 40 years has a different view
|
|
of life, that the show is somehow degraded, or downgraded, or
|
|
dropped in opinion...this simply reinforces the notion, held by
|
|
many, that a lot of folks in the religious right wish to make sure
|
|
no other perspective or lifestyle is ever shown on television, at
|
|
any time, unless in a negative fashion.
|
|
The thing of it is, while on the one hand I'm getting praise from
|
|
religious folks for addressing spirituality in my series (speaking
|
|
here as an atheist), I've gotten flack from others who think it
|
|
has no place in a SCIENCE fiction series, and why the hell am I
|
|
putting something in that goes right against my own beliefs?
|
|
"Because," I tell them, "this show is not about reflecting my
|
|
beliefs, or yours, or somebody else's, it's about telling this
|
|
story, about these people, with as much honesty and integrity as I
|
|
can summon up. That means conceding the fact that religious people
|
|
are going to be around 260 years from now." Well, fact is, all
|
|
kinds of people are going to be around 260 years from now. And
|
|
what did the anti-religion folks say specifically about including
|
|
spirituality in my series? "It's not *necessary*," they said.
|
|
Translation: they didn't like it. Well, tough. It was right for
|
|
this story, and this show. And it seems to me rather hypocritical
|
|
for some folks, who applaud the show for tolerance, for my
|
|
standing up to those who want to exclude religion from TV, to then
|
|
turn around and say the show is diminished because it showed that
|
|
same tolerance...to another group or perspective. I guess
|
|
tolerance is only okay as long as it's pointed one way.
|
|
You say that as a christian, you think any sex except that between
|
|
a husband and a wife to be wrong. Well, as I recall, the bible
|
|
also speaks against murder. We've depicted deaths by the hundreds
|
|
of thousands. (And we're talking here about the *depicting* of the
|
|
act, simply showing it, not the value judgements made after the
|
|
fact.) Why does the one (which is so barely hinted at as to be
|
|
almost invisible) cause the show to be diminished where the other
|
|
does not?
|
|
My job is not to reinforce your personal political, social or
|
|
religious beliefs. My job is not to reinforce MY personal
|
|
political, social or religious beliefs. Then it isn't art or
|
|
storytelling anymore, it's simply propaganda. My job is to tell
|
|
this story, about these people, AS people, as mixed and varied as
|
|
they are today. And there is no outside objective criteria as to
|
|
what is, or isn't *necessary* in a story; that is the sole
|
|
province of the author. You may or may not like it. You may or may
|
|
not choose to watch it. Just as people who don't like to see
|
|
religion and god discussed on TV may dislike it or choose not to
|
|
watch it.
|
|
But you'll excuse me if I see complaints about this one little
|
|
thing from the religious side, after all I've done to present
|
|
religious characters and the religious life in a positive fashion,
|
|
to be hypocritical and frankly somewhat ungrateful. It's as though
|
|
all this means nothing because of one thing, one outside-imposed
|
|
litmus test that disregards anything and everything else that has
|
|
been done.
|
|
So straight up...if I should stop tolerating or showing viewpoints
|
|
that are not my own (spoken as someone who is absolutely
|
|
straight), then should I now stop showing religion as well?
|
|
Because that's what this comes down to. Is that what you want?
|
|
Because religion is included at my discretion as well as anything
|
|
else on this show. You want me to be less tolerant? Just say the
|
|
word.
|
|
* Ken: yes, showing does not mean endorsing, showing just means
|
|
saying "this is here," not to make an issue of it. If I'm going to
|
|
start endorsing ANYbody's POV around here, it's going to be mine,
|
|
and I think we all know how dreadful THAT would be.
|
|
As for "including controversy rather than skirting it," this is
|
|
more or less the point. The goal here is to not have our
|
|
characters or our show make *value judgments* about what our
|
|
characters do, because then you're hitting the audience over the
|
|
head with the MESSAGE. "Believers" is a good example of that; some
|
|
came away using parts of that to argue pro and anti interference
|
|
in medical situations; ditto for "Confessions" which hit squarely
|
|
on BOTH sides of the issue (no, you can't blame morality for
|
|
disease...but then, we had our characters openly requiring blood
|
|
testing, which annoys many on the other side of the issue)....my
|
|
sense is that our audience is smart enough to take the elements we
|
|
present them with, and discuss them, and come to their own
|
|
conclusions and draw their own meanings from them. It's the part
|
|
of objecting to even *presenting* the situation that seems to me a
|
|
marginal position at best.
|
|
* They weren't shown in separate beds. We saw Talia reaching over to
|
|
the empty space in the bed where Ivanova had been, and finding her
|
|
gone.
|
|
* I didn't show a kiss because, in my experience, it's easier on all
|
|
around if one steps into the shallow end of the pool first, and
|
|
walks into the deep end rather than diving in and splashing
|
|
everybody in the process.
|
|
* _Wouldn't Talia have discovered Ivanova's secret if they were
|
|
intimate?_
|
|
Well, a telepath can also hold it back and avoid dipping any
|
|
further into someone's mind, if not permitted or asked not to do
|
|
so.
|
|
* As for Ivanova...remember that the core of good drama is conflict.
|
|
So here we have a situation where a possible romantic involvement
|
|
is shaping up for her in year three. It shouldn't be made too
|
|
easy. So you create a situation that really hurts her deeply; she
|
|
made a difficult step, got over her distance, opened herself up,
|
|
became vulnerable...and got hurt very badly as a result. The same
|
|
thing that happened in first season, when her old flame was
|
|
discovered to be a big guy with Home Guard.
|
|
You now have someone who's freshly hurt, who is going to be
|
|
unwilling or slow to open up again, who's now experienced every
|
|
kind of relationship and NONE of them have worked...in short,
|
|
she's one exposed nerve ending, perfect for someone now to come in
|
|
who may be right, but for whom she has little time, and is
|
|
disposed not to get involved.
|
|
Sounds a lot like my own dating history...keep them razor blades
|
|
and salt sprays a'comin.....
|
|
* No, the Ivanova revelation in "Loyalties" has nothing to do with
|
|
replacing Talia; that is a moot point in many ways, since Lyta is
|
|
back, and since other things happen which take that issue off the
|
|
table in any event.
|
|
* Didn't say Talia WAS a psi-cop, Talia said she *interned with* the
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PsiCops. Bear in mind that you're going to need support staff,
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lower level liaisons, and a bunch of other positions as well as
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the actual cops. _JMS has names confused; Lyta interned with the
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PsiCops._
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* _Did Bester try to befriend Talia because she was Control? (cf.
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[41]"A Race Through Dark Places")_
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You're assuming Bester knows everything. Also, Bester's interest
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|
may have been more...carnal than PsiCorp oriented.
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* _If Laurel Takashima had stayed with the crew and shot Garibaldi
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|
in "Chrysalis," would she have been Control?_
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Yes, Laurel would've been Control.
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* Mike: your assessment is pretty much correct. Laurel was to be the
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|
traitor initially; as I noted long, long time ago, and you quoted,
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she was not, in fact, acting entirely under her own volition.
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There would indeed have been an implanted personality there,
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|
acting without even her knowing about it. And it would've been
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|
this implanted personality that would've shot Garibaldi.
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When I took Laurel off the board, elements of this were
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|
transferred to other characters. This is the kind of thing I mean
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|
when I say that even with changes here and there, the story
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|
continues to go where I want it to go. We don't necessarily
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|
remember *which* general put the briefcase with a bomb next to
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|
Hitler's chair in the bunker, only that it got done. Some chairs
|
|
are moveable, some are not, as anyone who's ever written a novel
|
|
from an outline can tell you...you start moving the chairs around,
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|
but you always keep going where you're going.
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|
* Yeah, originally it was the Kosh-scan that would've gotten Lyta in
|
|
trouble; the TK aspect was originally going to come in from
|
|
another angle, but I was able to collapse the two in Talia, and
|
|
then bring Lyta in from a different direction, as you'll see in
|
|
one of the first batch of new year 3 eps.
|
|
* If Laurel *had* stayed with the show, by the middle of year two
|
|
the fact that she was Control would've been revealed via the
|
|
password incident. At that point, one particular possibility was
|
|
that her second in command under her -- a rather dour Russian
|
|
lieutenant named Ivanova -- would've been promoted to take her
|
|
place, while Laurel was moved off the chessboard. (This was
|
|
planned because we knew going in that Tamlyn Tomita had a growing
|
|
film career, and we probably could've only kept her for a couple
|
|
of years in the best of circumstances. So why not turn that to
|
|
your advantage?)
|
|
The position now being occupied by Corwin, Ivanova's second, is
|
|
the position that Ivanova would've held (though more prominently)
|
|
if Laurel had stayed on. (And no, Corwin doesn't now have that arc
|
|
lurking in the background.)
|
|
See, it's easy to stick to an outline and never diverge if you're
|
|
writing characters in a novel; in a TV show, with live actors, you
|
|
have to be flexible, plan ahead, come up with contingency plans,
|
|
and have threads that weave and interlock in ways to leave you
|
|
maximum flexibility while still proceeding toward your
|
|
destination.
|
|
* Takashima would have been the one to be Control. A Psi Corps
|
|
plant. (Her background on Mars would've been the perfect time for
|
|
it to have happened.) When Laurel went away, I took that one
|
|
thread and passed it along to Talia, setting it up as early as the
|
|
very first episode, when Talia and Ivanova first meet, and later
|
|
reluctantly have a drink.
|
|
At one point, Ivanova says to Talia, referencing Ivanova's mother,
|
|
"You're as much of a victim as she was." To which Talia replies,
|
|
"I don't feel like a victim." And, of course, that's exactly what
|
|
she was, though she didn't know it yet. Ivanova's analysis was
|
|
100% correct.
|
|
|
|
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|
[47][Next]
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[48]Last update: August 8, 1997
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References
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1. file://localhost/cgi-bin/imagemap/titlebar
|
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2. LYNXIMGMAP:file://localhost/lurk/maps/maps.html#titlebar
|
|
3. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/background/041.shtml
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|
4. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/synops/041.html
|
|
5. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/credits/041.html
|
|
6. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/episodes.php
|
|
7. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/040.html
|
|
8. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/042.html
|
|
9. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/041.html#OV
|
|
10. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/041.html#BP
|
|
11. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/041.html#UQ
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12. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/041.html#AN
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|
13. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/041.html#NO
|
|
14. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/041.html#JS
|
|
15. http://us.imdb.com/M/person-exact?+Tallman,+Patricia
|
|
16. file://localhost/lurk/p5/intro.html
|
|
17. file://localhost/lurk/p5/041
|
|
18. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/000.html
|
|
19. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/028.html
|
|
20. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/006.html
|
|
21. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/041.html#AN
|
|
22. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/028.html
|
|
23. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/021.html
|
|
24. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/028.html
|
|
25. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/009.html
|
|
26. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/021.html
|
|
27. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/041.html#JS
|
|
28. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/028.html
|
|
29. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/020.html
|
|
30. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/040.html
|
|
31. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/027.html
|
|
32. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/006.html
|
|
33. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/033.html
|
|
34. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/034.html
|
|
35. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/041.html#JS:takashima
|
|
36. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/000.html
|
|
37. file://localhost/lurk/comic/008.html
|
|
38. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/038.html
|
|
39. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/035.html
|
|
40. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/021.html
|
|
41. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/030.html
|
|
42. file://localhost/lurk/lurker.html
|
|
43. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/041.html#TOP
|
|
44. file://localhost/cgi-bin/uncgi/lgmail
|
|
45. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/episodes.php
|
|
46. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/040.html
|
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47. file://localhost/home/woodstock/hyperion/docs/lurk/guide/042.html
|
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48. file://localhost/lurk/lastmod.html
|